Saturday, 24 February 2007

Head In A Hat




This Is Really How He Came Up With His Book Of Mormon ! By Putting His Head In His Hat ! And Using His Seer Stone. The same one he used for treasure digging .



Russell M. Nelson, “A Treasured Testament,” Ensign, Jul 1993, 61
Adapted from an address given 25 June 1992 at a seminar for new mission presidents, Missionary Training Center, Provo, Utah.


"The details of this miraculous method of translation are still not fully known. Yet we do have a few precious insights. David Whitmer wrote:
Joseph Smith would put the seer stone into a hat, and put his face in the hat, drawing it closely around his face to exclude the light; and in the darkness the spiritual light would shine. A piece of something resembling parchment would appear, and on that appeared the writing. One character at a time would appear, and under it was the interpretation in English. Brother Joseph would read off the English to Oliver Cowdery, who was his principal scribe, and when it was written down and repeated to Brother Joseph to see if it was correct, then it would disappear, and another character with the interpretation would appear. Thus the Book of Mormon was translated by the gift and power of God, and not by any power of man.” (David Whitmer, An Address to All Believers in Christ, Richmond, Mo.: n.p., 1887, p. 12.)"







This is just a small transcript from the John Dehlin Interview with Richard Lyman Bushman about Joseph Smith Dictating or Reading from his peepstone with his head in his hat.



This Picture on the Left is how I was misled to believe about the translation process until I found out it was with sticking his head in a hat. The LDS church is knowingly misleading members and investigators as it has done from its very inception .



John Dehlin so that’s , you know most people would be just stunned to know that there’s no real evidence that the plates were used materially in the translation and that the Urim and Thumin meaning the crystals in the breastplate weren’t used either . That’s real different from the accounts that we kind of grew up with in Primary and Sunday school and seminary .

Richard Bushman Yea well that’s the account that’s in the historical records though so we just have to live with it .

John Dehlin so we have to live with it …...erm and you know this really does bring up the question or two questions err one is Isn’t it completely dishonest or disingenuous to ever use the word translate or translation . Aren’t those just the wrong words first of all and then I’ll ask you the second question later so lets start there , why do we even call it a translation .

Richard Bushman Well Nibley’s discoursed on that subject , what does it mean to translate or carry over from one , one culture or one time to another err you know errr use the word translated to talk about bodies being resurrected or carried about one way or another . So I don’t think you could call it dishonest it certainly has misled us into thinking that you know I used to speculate that Joseph Smith learned Reformed Egyptian pearing at those plates and coming up with the words and that of course is besides the point as you see it this way, erm so maybe we do need to have another word, I think we certainly need to make clear to our children as we teach them or whoever that we refer to a translation is carrying a message from one culture into the language of another not necessarily using a dictionary so you do have to generalise or change the meaning of the translation from ordinary usage .

John Dehlin Ok err and do you think we need to change the art and the pictures and the graphics in the motion pictures that we are using to depict the process , do you think its disingenuous to continue having the curtain and using some type of spectacles and showing Joseph staring at the plates thinking earnestly and then you know dictating , Do you think that that’s something we need to change maybe ?


Richard Bushman Yea I definitely think we need to change it . Its not because erm you know it’s a horrible mistake you know because the guys who do those pictures are not trying to deceive anyone that’s what they think actually happened .It’s just a matter of accuracy and the problem is if that if you’re not accurate then you down the line you put your own erm credibility in jeopardy and I don’t , I just want to think all of our young people should think that they’re really getting the straight story on Joseph Smith or they’re going to go through the experience you’ve had , disillusionment , anger ,it’s a very sad thing and it’s unnecessary , so we do need to avoid that .


For the full Interview on Audio


117 comments:

Astarte Moonsilver said...

Keep up the good work, Elder Joseph. All of our blogs together bring people out of the cult every day, and it's really got them uptight!

I wouldn't be surprised if they try to buy up Blogger and Google just to keep us all quiet!

thekingpin68 said...

Hello,

It looks like we may have another "Rick B"...the blog even looks similar.;) Thanks for the article.
I am no expert on the LDS but I dealt with their view on gods here in part of an article:

http://thekingpin68.blogspot.com/2006/10/vicious-regress_9703.html

Cheers,

Russ:)

rick b said...

A question for everyone to think about, mainly the LDS is this.

If this was really how the BoM was translated, and I know some LDS who do not believe it was, But anyway, the question is this.

If this is the correct view, why are their over 4,000 changes to the BoM? their cannot be one change made, otherwise the letter could not have been removed after Joseph Smith read it off.

Then this would also mean that the A. of F. number 8 would be incorrect. It should read, (We believe the Bible to be the Word of God, in so far as it is translated correctly, And the Book of Mormon is the Word of God, in so far as it is translated correctly.)

The real A. of F. 8 says, (We believe the Bible to be the Word of God, in so far as it is translated correctly, And the Book of Mormon is the Word of God.) Rick b

Galatian said...

Hey EJ,

Thanks for the note. Actually those are entries diary entries I wrote about a year ago. So the self doubts and questioning are fairly old. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind whatsoever that Mormonism is a fraud, and I won't ever doubt it again.
I am done with doubting and loathing myself. It is Mormonism that needs to be doubted and loathed - it truly is a con!! I agree 100% with your remarks.

Btw, I saw your new video about Joseph Smith and the hat-translating, and I thought it was great! I especially loved the church music in the background (lol) good job!!

Zelph said...

Your blog looks very similar to mine, I know it gets over-bearing at times, but I am going to put a link to your blog from mine.

JulieAnn said...

Hey, how come you are MIA? Love your posts...

Sister Mary Lisa said...

I'm enjoying your comments over on Zelph's blog.

I Nephi 3:7 said...

I don't know where on earth you got that picture, but it is commonly taught among the church that Joseph Smith used the Urim and Thummim to translate. True, when viewed as a joke, the picture is hilarious. I have no idea where you got the idea that changes have been made to the Book of Mormon (true, when first published, the publishers did take some liberties of punctuation, etc.), but please state a reference.
True, we believe that there are multiple Gods, However, we are only of one God, therefore we worship only the one who made us. We also believe that if we keep the commandments, get baptized, get our temple endowments, etc, we, too, can become Gods of our own worlds and creations. I would reccomend heading over to Mormon Truth and looking in on the first set of comments there.
God bless.

Sydney said...

Awesome blog, thank you for the comments on mine as well. Good luck to you! Hope to chat with you more!

-Sydney

brooksrobinson said...

I ran across your blog. I to have been researching Mormonism and have come up with the same conclusions as you. I've read various pieces of the BoM as well as sermons from the Journal of Discourses. I see a contradicting theology to the Bible. Stop by my blog would love to hear what you think.

fizix137 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

Here is a related article:

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Anonymous said...

Sorry, re-posting as a hyperlink:

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Jake said...

JOSEPH SMITH TRANSLATED THE BOOK OF MORMON FROM THE PLATES!!! NOT A HAT!!!

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